hks supercharger

[aukword1]

yeah, i was thinking the same thing...if i put high comp pistons in, i wouldn't be able to turbo it in the future unless i convert back to low comp. I'm thinking of getting a smaller pulley for the SC and seeing how much more psi that will give...i don't want to go too high, maybe 6-8 tops...i was told that these take oil so no teflon coating was needed(but definitely would've been a plus). I figure, if i don't like it at 6-8 psi, i will just go turbo and maybe in the future just pick up a used 4age and rebuild it and throw the sc on that engine. First things first though, i need to get megasquirt.

[Kando]

The oil has nothing to do with the rotors. The oil in the HKS charger is only for the sc gears that spin the rotors, just like with the 4agze sc-12 charger. Also, the HKS version has no dipstick for measuring and topping the oil off. The teflon, so to speak, was used on the sc-12 rotors to help with sealing, and handling high temps. The HKS was developed before thoughts, or possibilities, of that were around.

[yoshimitsuspeed]

The HKS sc blower was a TX-12, with 1160 cc capacity, and 11k rpm limit.

I am curious where you get your info. You seem to know a lot but much of your info is not terribly accurate.

The TX12 is still available. It uses coated rotors.
It is possible it didn't at one point but that brings me to my next question. You act like the HKS kit predates the GZE by a significant amount. If so then how much? I always assumed the HKS came out after the GZE. In which case it seems weird that the SC12 and current TX12 would have coated rotors but the HKS would not.
Unless maybe HKS was being cheap.
Third question. Are we sure they are uncoated? This is why I wanted to see pics inside the SC.

Well, you've got a couple of things to think about here, when it comes to upgrading engine components. To use the HKS kit safely, without destroying it, and getting decent safe output from it, you'll want hi-comp pistons, but probably not overly hi-comp.

You have a very crude yet annoyingly unwavering view on boosting and how it should be done.
The kit will be plenty safe regardless of compression. The motor on the other hand may not. The amount of boost is one of the smaller concerns here and the outlet temps will be the greatest concern for concerns of detonation.
12 PSI and 10:1 compression on this supercharger with an intercooler would likely be safer than 6 PSI and 9:1 without.

Remember that this was designed to work on a standard 4age engine before extra high comp pistons were introduced. So around 9.4:1 comp rate would be preferable.

Compression ratio has slowly increased as technology and fuel quality has improved. The preferable compression ratio completely depends on so many other variables your argument is completely invalid.

But if you did I wouldn't try getting more than about an extra 2 psi out of it, which means about 6 total. After all these were very early stage sc's before mainstream manufacturing of them occurred.

If this is in fact an Ogura supercharger it will have gone through rigorous and extensive testing before earning that 1.8:1 PR rating. There is no reason to believe the SC shouldn't be able to handle that. The motor without intercooling on the other hand may be another story.

After all these were very early stage sc's before mainstream manufacturing of them occurred.

Again, before the GZE? If so how long before?

Not that it really matters because roots type air pumps have been around since the mid 1800s and have been in production cars since the 20s.
That is what I would consider early stages.

http://www.superchargersonline.com/inde ... page&id=34

and in that case having put in hi-comp pistons already will be a bit of a limiting factor to later turbo set-ups.

Again it totally depends on his goals and his setup.
If he wants 600 hp then yeah high comp may be a challenge. Even then with E85 and or meth injection it might be a great setup.
If he wants to run 15 PSI on pump gas with good engine management then something like 10:1 would be awesome. Even 11:1 with some 264ish cams would still allow you to run 10-15 PSI pretty easily.
High comp and boost is awesome if you do it right.

[Kando]

I've studied these kits for years, that's where I get my info, and I have owned an almost identical, but even more rare NIB Blitz aw11 sc kit.

Whereas on the other hand you simply get your rocks off by spouting large quantities of largely misguided, and often unsupported cr@p.

You sir, are nothing but an annoying pimp, who butts into any and every thread where you think you have even the remotest chance of selling something to someone. The moderators on this and several other forums should clamp down on your endless tripe, as you are single handedly driving away numerous people who simply avoid commenting on any thread where you appear.

I apologize to the OP, but I'm out of here. You'll have to deal with the yosh on your own. But if you want real advice seek it from anyone other than him, lol.

[aukword1]

i didnt intend to make a thread where ppl wouldnt get along, but rather a thread where ideas can come together...the front plate on the SC says it can handle 26 psi....i would think 10 psi would be good without it hurting the sc much...i was told the sc-12 chargers fail eventually due to mechanical issues and that the hks was a better unit...everyone that i i've talked to regarding this charger recommends it over the sc-12 charger... but this info is coming from japan so i dont know if i should believe it or not. either way, I will try it and see how it works...if it breaks, it breaks. Then turbo will be my next option, i am just hoping to get some fun out of it before it does go out...I can take pics of the inside of it and post it on here tomorrow...i'm already in the works of getting a smaller pulley for it as well.

[yoshimitsuspeed]

I've studied these kits for years,

What do you mean by studied? As in read internet folk lore and continued to pass it down as best you can remember it?

Whereas on the other hand you simply get your rocks off by spouting large quantities of largely misguided, and often unsupported cr@p.

Lol that's funny.
I'm one of the few people on the boards who actually supports their findings with links, quotes and research to back up and show that I have studied what I know and can back it up. If someone ever wants me to show more or prove something to be true I am more than happy to oblige. Others on the other hand rarely do.
On this particular subject I have spent hours talking to and emailing with Ogura. I have maps, drawings and pricing on all their superchargers but unfortunately I have been asked not to make those public.
I doubt there is anyone outside of Ogura who has been inside as many Ogura superchargers as I have.
http://www.matrixgarage.com/?q=content/ ... vice-guide

I don't know a lot on the HKS or blitz kits specifically which is why I was asking questions but if you would care to challenge anything I have said about anything I welcome it.

You sir, are nothing but an annoying pimp, who butts into any and every thread where you think you have even the remotest chance of selling something to someone.

Lol I had been on these boards for nearly a decade before I even started my business. If you took a minute to look at my overall activity you would see that probably 20% of my posts have anything to do with my buisness and only when it's directly relevant. 4 Years ago I would have suggested they get parts from twosrus, T3 or other places. Now If I can provide parts or services I offer them. If not I still often refer people to other vendors who can despite never having that favor returned.

as you are single handedly driving away numerous people who simply avoid commenting on any thread where you appear.

If they are confident in their knowledge then they should have no reason not to post.
For every person who gets their panties in a twist a hundred others come to me asking for advice, thank me in threads, thank me for helping them see things more clearly or have a better grasp on understanding the deeper science, physics and dynamics behind the things I have spent decades trying to understand.
I figure those odds are good enough for me. After all you can't please everyone.

You say I spout unsupported crap but instead of replying with useful information and supported it with any sort of links, quotes, books or really anything at all I would be happy with what you have to say. Instead you get all pissed and resort to personal attacks and tell me I'm wrong without mentioning one thing that you disagree with.

[yoshimitsuspeed]

the front plate on the SC says it can handle 26 psi.

I am quite certain that plate means PSIA (absolute) which will be 12 PSIG. Even the best modern superchargers are only rated to about 2.2:1 pressure ratio which is only about 17.5 PSI.
Here is one of the new Eaton TVS maps as an example.


Like I said earlier the Ogura SCs are rated to 1.8:1 or about 12 PSIG.
Like I also said though the biggest thing here is the outlet temps without intercooling. Those temps going straight into the engine would be very detrimental.

i was told the sc-12 chargers fail eventually due to mechanical issues and that the hks was a better unit...everyone that i i've talked to regarding this charger recommends it over the sc-12 charger... but this info is coming from japan so i dont know if i should believe it or not.

The only reason this would even be the tiniest bit true is because the chances of finding an SC12 with less than 150k miles on it is almost zero and the chances of finding an HKS kit with more than 150k miles on it is almost zero so chances are that the HKS SC would have a lot more life in it.
Since I have started offereing SC12 service and repair about two years ago I have only had about 5 SCs come in. One was from super rust zone Canada and the stator back plate had rusted all the way through. Another came in for basic service but did have a couple bolt tabs broken on the snout that caused it to rub lightly. It looks like it must have been dropped on the snout at some point. The others have appeared to be in great overall condition and have just gotten basic service and protective coating. The SC12s are getting more rare and much harder to find in good condition but they are incredibly robust units. It is very likely the HKS unit is nearly identical and very unlikely it has anything that makes it in any way superior to the SC12.
I would be very curious to know where you have heard this. I fear it's very likely people just assume that because it's HKS it must be better.

I would love to see pics of the inside and outside.
Like I said earlier as for making boost the first thing I would look into is a bigger crank pulley. Should be easy to find a stock GZE crank pulley. I don't think you will be able to run it on a longitudinal pulley anyway but I could be wrong about that. If it's designed for the FR pulley then I don't think you will be able to run a GZE pulley.

[aukword1]

i have the stock gze pulley, my original question was if it would run with the gze stock pulley but i lined it up and it looks like it will work...I will post some pics tomorrow of the inside and the whole charger itself...like i said, i dont know if the sc 12 it better or worse but i just heard things from ppl, i had an sc=12 and sold it, it looked a bit smaller but basically they seem identical, same intake manifold and everything..

[yoshimitsuspeed]

i have the stock gze pulley, my original question was if it would run with the gze stock pulley but i lined it up and it looks like it will work...I will post some pics tomorrow of the inside and the whole charger itself...like i said, i dont know if the sc 12 it better or worse but i just heard things from ppl,

What people?
Do you have any links or anything? I'm curious to know what they said.

[aukword1]

just ppl that i've talked to, no hard evidence to back it up...which is why i really respect your opinion...

[aukword1]

well a little bit of bad news, the hks charger pulley housing is too long for it to work on the gze block. It doesn't line up with the crank pulley. Looks like i will instead go the turbo route on the gze engine...

[aukword1]

here is a pic of the internals of it...

[yoshimitsuspeed]

well a little bit of bad news, the hks charger pulley housing is too long for it to work on the gze block. It doesn't line up with the crank pulley. Looks like i will instead go the turbo route on the gze engine...

No difference between the GZE and NA blocks or head. Only difference could be on the pulley.

You have any other pics of the SC?
Does the plate on it say anything other than the boost rating or whatever it was?
I think you will be very happy with a small turbo on there.

[aukword1]

yea im thinking only the pulley could be the difference...brings me back to fitting water pumps on the engine...the plate on the front says it can handle 26psi or 1.8bar and 11k rpm...among other things...if you want a pic of it i can take it, just let me know what you want pics of. I would just have to upload them. I am really considering turbo for this engine though, i don't know if the sc will even line up properly with the gze crank pulley...but i want to get megasquirt and some gauges before i pull the engine out again and test the theory...if it is too long, i will go with turbo...just let me know if you want additional pics

[aukword1]

here is the front plate

[yoshimitsuspeed]

Interesting. I haven't heard of an SX11.
There isn't a date on there that I am missing is there?

Note the A in barA. That means absolute which includes atmospheric. SCs don't really care about how much boost, they only care about pressure ratio but I assume they figure that would go over most peoples heads so instead put bar.
So at sea level you could run 1.8 bar (26.46 PSI) absolute or .8 bar (11.76 PSI)gauge.

[aukword1]

Nah no date on it as far as i know...i would assume that since the alternator, with gts brackets, lines up with the crank pulley perfectly, the sc should as well. Only one way to find out for sure though....also, t3 sells an oversized crank pulley for aw11...that should copensate for some of the lack in boost fom the comp pistons