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Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:15 pm
by E_Money
Just wondering if all blacktops are the same? I see some people say get the 6 speed with lsd like its something special. Will the 6 speed transmission fit directly on the AE86 Corolla? What transmission is it anyways? Is the 6 speed blacktops special and is the lsd rare or something?

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:54 pm
by ronny
club4ag,

Image

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 2:57 pm
by Yosuke

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:22 pm
by E_Money
both the links dont answer my questions. all it talks about is silvertops and blacktops which i already know.

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:27 pm
by Yosuke
If you know all about Silvertops and Blacktops, why dont you dont know that a FF transmission (Toyota E58) will not fit a FR RWD car?

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 4:29 pm
by gaijin_rokurunner
Ronny that was some funny **** needed that laugh...e-money think u need to do some research via google on the ae86 and the 20v because tour questions just showed your newbieness... Give u a hint the ae86 is rwd, the 20v is fwd...with that said the lsd and 5 or 6 speed tranny dont apply to the ae86 platform...unless your doing a monster garage first fwd ae86 ever!

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 5:29 pm
by E_Money
well kind of knew that ae111 is a fwd. i just dont know if it the transmission can be converted to work with the ae86. i just saw some people in forums stating to get the 6 speed with lsd as if it can fit in the ae86. i just know the major differences between the engines and not much about the transmission so sorry there if i offended you. im just trying to get info.

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:01 pm
by Jacare
I'm sorry, but your post are getting ridiculous. Just saying

And to help you
www.billzilla.org/4agstock.htm

You really need to google

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:10 pm
by gaijin_rokurunner
There is a six speed tranny conversion but no fwd setup will work in the ae86 ! Like i said read thru the tech section do a little google searching and if your still confused come back

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:20 pm
by E_Money
All its saying is things about 20v silver tops and black tops but doesnt say if theres different models of a black top. If my post are ridiculous then why bother wasting your time? If people really want to help me they will. Gaijin thanks. I dont want to convert to fwd just want to know if i can use the 6 speed.

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 6:44 pm
by LongGrain
no, you cant. jesus christ. have you ever even LOOKED at a transmission?

no you cant use a front wheel drive transmission for a FR application.

Yes, that is a ridiculous question, no matter how many times you get mad at people for telling you so.

ae111 black top is an ae111 black top is an ae111 black top. Transmission doesnt matter because you cant use it anyway...

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:33 pm
by E_Money
Okay i got that but my original question is are all black tops the same regardless if they came with the 6 speed lsd or a 5 speed?

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 8:40 pm
by E_Money
Just dont want to spend $2000 for something I dont need.

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 10:07 pm
by LongGrain
I JUST <edited> said, a blacktop is a blacktop is a blacktop.

is that not clear enough?

I'm sorry but pretty much every one of your threads is a really juvenile question such as this one. learn to use google before making yourself look like an 11 year old.



OST wrote - PLEASE control the obscene language!

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 10:28 pm
by Jacare
E_Money wrote: If my post are ridiculous then why bother wasting your time?

because we've done that since the beginning of January when this board was relaunched, which is also around the time you started a thread for every question you had. questions mind you that may have been able to be solved by just Googleing the question.
it needs to be slowed down

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Fri Mar 22, 2013 11:54 pm
by Yosuke
Club4ag,

Image

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:33 am
by phanist
e_money

man all black top are the same. the transmission only apply to a Front Wheel Drive CAR... ae86 is a rear wheel drive car... so u cant use the original blacktop tranny.....u have to Reuse your ae86 tranny which is a t50 from a GTS from my understanding... so just buy the black top at the lowest price possible that is in working condition of course.. dont worry about the tanny it came with.. u should be worry about ECU, coil, igniter, the list go on...
correct me if im wrong guy

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 9:39 am
by E_Money
phanist wrote:e_money

man all black top are the same. the transmission only apply to a Front Wheel Drive CAR... ae86 is a rear wheel drive car... so u cant use the original blacktop tranny.....u have to Reuse your ae86 tranny which is a t50 from a GTS from my understanding... so just buy the black top at the lowest price possible that is in working condition of course.. dont worry about the tanny it came with.. u should be worry about ECU, coil, igniter, the list go on...
correct me if im wrong guy


I really appreciate your nonhostile answer. Thats all I needed to know thanks. 1400 is the lowest by far that ive seen on ebay. Theres one thats for 2 grand but now that you've reassured me im glad i didnt end up buying it.

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 1:49 pm
by Deuce Cam
Transmission compatibility aside, I think some people are under the impression that the engine in the 6 speed equipped ae111's had a better/newer blacktop for some reason, compared to models equipped with the same engine that didn't have a 6 speed.

I've noticed some people with blacktop swapped 86's will go out of their way to say the engine originally came out of a bzr, "that had the 6 speed, lsd, etc...." Of course this info is also advertised when an engine importer is selling an engine swap for obvious reasons. Because of this it's not hard to see why people may think there are different version blacktops.

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 2:45 pm
by E_Money
Deuce Cam wrote:Transmission compatibility aside, I think some people are under the impression that the engine in the 6 speed equipped ae111's had a better/newer blacktop for some reason, compared to models equipped with the same engine that didn't have a 6 speed.

I've noticed some people with blacktop swapped 86's will go out of their way to say the engine originally came out of a bzr, "that had the 6 speed, lsd, etc...." Of course this info is also advertised when an engine importer is selling an engine swap for obvious reasons. Because of this it's not hard to see why people may think there are different version blacktops.


yeah thats why I had to ask before I buy it. Didn't want to spend 500-800 dollars extra for the same thing in a 5 speed. But now I know that there isn't any difference in models. Thanks for the clarification guys. SAVE ME MY BUX!

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 2:55 pm
by ronny
the only advantage of having a BZr is that its the latest model.. prob less usage.. majority of all 20v are fucked anyway.. you have to overhaul them..

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 5:19 pm
by mikeyee
motor is inching to 20 y/o. you're probably going to get what you pay for, unless you're getting one from a reputable distributor (even then, it's iffy).

better off getting one, and doing a rebuild despite what the advert listing says.


and this:

Jacare wrote:because we've done that since the beginning of January when this board was relaunched, which is also around the time you started a thread for every question you had. questions mind you that may have been able to be solved by just Googleing the question.
it needs to be slowed down


can't go around asking simple questions (like you've been) expecting to get spoon feed info and no expect this response when it's obvious you're not putting the effort yourself in finding the answers.

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Sat Mar 23, 2013 11:30 pm
by E_Money
well i tried google to see if black tops had different models and majority of the site just gave me silver top vs black top differences. I was looking into specifically black tops and any significant changes in the motor that came with six speed and one that had a 5 speed. if you can link me to a website that specifically talks about 1995 and 1998 black top engines i would i appreciate it as I could not find it.

and i only had posted 3 threads which I could not find the answers to 20V turbo builds info because majority keep 20v n/a.

but i bought the black top, overhaul set, new ecu, forged internals, along with a turbo kit so I'll figure it out on my own.

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 2:33 am
by phanist
the different between the blacktop with 5speed or 6speed is the transmission it self.. the motor/engine is the same...only the transmission one is 5 speed and one is 6speed.. 1 gear more than the other transmission.. i dont believe the different transmission make the car any faster... but then again u will not be using that original blacktop fwd transmission in the ae86 any way..
buy the blacktop if that what u want.. pull out your stock 16v and drop in the blacktop.... there u go .............. done

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 9:08 am
by oldeskewltoy
First... KEEP asking the question YOU want answered... hostile people will always be hostile!

There ARE differences... BUT it depends on WHAT you are going to use.........

The most SIGNIFICANT difference is the 5 spd and 6 spd use DIFFERENT ECUs

The 5 speed ECU - 89661-1A470 - is used not only in the AE111, but it is also used in some of the AE101 models(Silvertop?) models as well.

Mechanically, there are no significant differences between a 5 spd equipped and a 6 speed equipped blacktop 20V

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Mon Mar 25, 2013 6:33 pm
by E_Money
oldeskewltoy wrote:First... KEEP asking the question YOU want answered... hostile people will always be hostile!

There ARE differences... BUT it depends on WHAT you are going to use.........

The most SIGNIFICANT difference is the 5 spd and 6 spd use DIFFERENT ECUs

The 5 speed ECU - 89661-1A470 - is used not only in the AE111, but it is also used in some of the AE101 models(Silvertop?) models as well.

Mechanically, there are no significant differences between a 5 spd equipped and a 6 speed equipped blacktop 20V


thanks for the support

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 6:10 pm
by runkillerrabbit
lmao wow

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Sat Mar 30, 2013 8:54 pm
by runkillerrabbit
Image

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Sun Mar 31, 2013 11:17 am
by Tofu4u
E-Money:

You might want to consider looking into a Blacktop motor with an Automatic transmission. They are typically the cheapest out of the bunch and the LEAST abused.

You can even request the importer to sell you the motor itself without the automatic transmission and ECU and then pick up a 6 Spd manual transmission ECU from the forums for fairly cheap.

You'll save yourself more money in the end going this route.

Re: Are all blacktops the same or are there different kinds

Posted: Wed Apr 10, 2013 2:34 am
by phanist
E_money
just incase u didn't find a blacktop yet and still looking for one.. dont buy it from ALN JDM Motors.. they in Texas and JDM Engine Imports in florida .. these two guy are very dishonest group of seller...
they sold me a pre modify 20v ... i can't use it.. and it cost me 1750.00$ they send an engine with 20v blacktop head and unknown block.....Image