4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

1991celi
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4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby 1991celi » Fri Apr 26, 2013 6:42 pm

Alright, i swapped a 20v silvertop into my celica this fall to find out it was seized. this spring i finally got around to tearing the motor apart and unseize it. I managed to unsieze it but i have 2 major concerns that i was hoping that you guys could help me out with.

1. the motor will spin but stops abruptly when piston 1 and 4 hit tdc. (going to take the oil pan off tomorrow see whats up)
2. piston 2 (i believe) is higher than the rest at tdc.
This is the first time i have ever torn an engine apart so hoping i could get the help of you awesome people at club 4ag =)
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totta crolla
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby totta crolla » Sat Apr 27, 2013 2:26 am

All will be revealed when you remove the sump.
I would say that the piston that is higher than the rest is at the correct height.
Likely the big end bearing shells are completely knackered on the 3 "low" pistons.

1991celi
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby 1991celi » Sat Apr 27, 2013 11:33 am

i was wondering. can i even get at all the oil pan screws from under the car or would it just be easier to take the block out.

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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby totta crolla » Sat Apr 27, 2013 1:07 pm

I think the engine will need to come out as there is a very real chance the crank will need to be removed,
certainly if the engine seized on the crank rather than the pistons.

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1991celi
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby 1991celi » Sat Apr 27, 2013 9:20 pm

yeah, ill be taking it out and checking it out. but it disp[leases me that an importer would send an engine like this...

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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby carbd7age » Sun Apr 28, 2013 5:37 am

Seems like there's an epidemic of junk engines coming from importers. That's a quick way for a company to make a buck, buy a junk engines for nothin then sell it as good and rip you off. That sucks man. Pull it out and post pics. Maybe someone has some parts you need.
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1991celi
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby 1991celi » Sun Apr 28, 2013 2:57 pm

yeah man, i am just finishing up my semester in college so i will have tons of time to take it out.

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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby yoshimitsuspeed » Sun Apr 28, 2013 4:05 pm

I think this is a good lesson for people getting engines, be it from a JDM source or even a junk yard or other USDM motor.
One thing that I think should always be done while it's still sitting on the shipping palate and hopefully still has a trans on it.
Hook up power to the starter and do a compression test. This will at least tell you it's not seized and that it has good compression.
I didn't think about this on my motor till I had already pulled the trans and gotten it in the shop. Fortunately I got lucky with mine.
Once the motor is in the shop/garage pull the pan and main/crank caps and plasticgauge each one and inspect the bearings.
Pull the valve cover and inspect the top end as well as you can. Pulling cam caps would be a good idea.
At least now you have a decent idea of the overall condition of the motor and close to the ship date. If you send the a pic of toasted bearings two days after it shows up on your doorstep you will have a lot better luck getting the seller to work with you.
1991celi that really does suck. I would try to send pics to the seller and try to see if they will give you some money back or something. They probably won't be too compliant at this point though.
I agree that sellers should inspect and be confidant of what they are selling but it is just as much our responsibility to inspect and be confidant in what we are buying.

1991celi
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby 1991celi » Sun Apr 28, 2013 4:18 pm

my lesson was learned lol. but i got this motor from jdmstar and i will try to contact them. but the "warranty" is up so idk

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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby morgan » Mon Apr 29, 2013 9:27 am

i have a feeling this isnt going to turn out good. the pistons in the pic, top most one is cyl.#1. when #1 is down, #3 should be down too, and #2 & #4 will be up at that time. #2 or #3 seem to have a problem
haha cali...i got one of your 86's and you're not getting it back.
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby carbd7age » Mon Apr 29, 2013 11:20 am

Nah Craig you got that backwards. 1 and 4 go up together, 2 and 3 stay together. Unless 20v's are different and weird.
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morgan
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby morgan » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:01 pm

yeah, youre right. 20v's are the same as 16v's. in any sense, both pistons should be level with eachother, not so much in that pic. its been a while since i had a 4ag open... :lol:
haha cali...i got one of your 86's and you're not getting it back.
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby carbd7age » Mon Apr 29, 2013 12:24 pm

Haha yeah that pic made me sad inside! 'Sposed to look like this:
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jdm86gtz
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby jdm86gtz » Mon Apr 29, 2013 2:37 pm

If it's locking and the piston is shy of the top deck it's probably a bent rod.

1991celi
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby 1991celi » Mon Apr 29, 2013 9:12 pm

yeah, i was thinking 3 had a bent rod? because 1 and 4 are the same height and both lock right before they reach the top and 2 reaches the top just fine.

1991celi
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby 1991celi » Sat May 18, 2013 3:42 pm

So I figured out what was causing the stoppage of the pistons. well here it is. Do anyone have a single piston rod they are willing to sell? haha
Image

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carbd7age
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby carbd7age » Sun May 19, 2013 4:41 am

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8Ton
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby 8Ton » Sun May 19, 2013 8:01 am

And that Is why I call BS when people claim the stock rods are cast. Any signs of corrosion in that cyl? I would suspect that the motor hydro locked before it was imported...

1991celi
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby 1991celi » Sun May 19, 2013 9:09 am

there is some corrosion near the top but very little. you are probably right.

Army Fork
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby Army Fork » Wed May 22, 2013 7:56 am

Nobody has cast rods in years, it's actually cheaper to forge them on a large scale. You can take a steel blank and smash it into the rough shape in a few short strikes, then it's all the machining you would have to do anyways with a cast part. On top of that, cast is generally **** for rods due to cast materials brittle nature and lack of elasticity.

Also, damn son.
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- Stance GR+ Coilovers
- Mishimoto Cooling
- T3 adjustable 4-bar, Panhard, traction brackets, tension rods
- T3 Short shift
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Army Fork
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Re: 4age 20v silvertop pistons locked help!

Postby Army Fork » Wed May 22, 2013 7:57 am

Just buy some new rods. Probably cost you $500 for a nice set of Crowers and you'll never bend them.
1984 SR5-GTS 20V ST/BT coupe.
- Stance GR+ Coilovers
- Mishimoto Cooling
- T3 adjustable 4-bar, Panhard, traction brackets, tension rods
- T3 Short shift
- Manual rack conversion
- Blacktop electronics

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