4a questions for turbo build

[yoshimitsuspeed]

Hmm so axels are goin to be an issue. Wouldnt they be an issue with any transmission i use?

You can't find E51 axles for the AW11 anymore, not new, not reman and very rarely even used. If you have axles and kill one there are a couple companies who will rebuild them.
[img]Wouldnt%20they%20be%20an%20issue%20with%20any%20transmission%20i%20use?[/img]
I can't help there but if the hubs take the same splines you may not have problems.
If your stock box is a C series then it seems pretty likely they could share the same hub dimensions. You don't really have a lot of other easy choices with the 4A though

[oldeskewltoy]

And did the 7rib 4afe that your using come with a counterweighted crank?

I'm using 20V block, crank, rods, with 4AGZE (8.9 to 1) pistons.

[alltracfreak]

Would i have the same problems if i used a 20v transmission?

[alltracfreak]

And the gts celica motor sits at an angle wouldnt that give me issues?

[alltracfreak]

So i read that the 20v transmission uses a 23 spline axel and my 91 stx celica uses a 20 spline. The 90-93 corolla uses a 23 spline as well. So how strong are the 20v transmissions?

[alltracfreak]

Wait it was for an automatic.......... is it going to be different?

[alltracfreak]

Im getting discouraged now

[alltracfreak]

If i cant find something that can handle 275whp at bare minimum then i probably will only swap a 20v in and call it a day

[yoshimitsuspeed]

If i cant find something that can handle 275whp at bare minimum then i probably will only swap a 20v in and call it a day

How do you plan on driving it? If you aren't going to abuse it too hard the C series should hold up to 300 HP well enough. If you plan on regularly drag racing or doing hard launches regularly maybe not but even then a 300 HP turbo won't hit boost till the clutch it out.
Also what are you looking for? A 250 hp turbo is going to be an insane difference from a stock 20v so it's kind of a huge leap to say you will just throw a 20v in it.
There are a few people racing turbo and SC motors on C series and they use the C series specifically because it's cheaper to repair or replace.

[alltracfreak]

Well i said i was goin to just throw a 20v in it because im in need of more power, but i would like 300hp. You do have a point the transmissions are cheap so if i do break 1 or 2 then it wouldnt be a big deal replacing them. It will vary rarely see hard launches mostly slipping the clutch out of the hole or from rolls or in the highway 5th gear pulls. Never power shifting to preserve the transmission i will shift like an old lady. And it would be nice to have an lsd

[alltracfreak]

Maybe ill lower my goal to 300whp max

[yoshimitsuspeed]

I think 250-300 is a great range for the 4AGE. You are still playing with turbos capable of reasonable spool keeping a nice broad predictable and usable power band.
Also remember like we were talking about earlier trying to make more power in the higher RPM will be easier on the trans.
300 HP with some cams and 8k redline would be a pretty sweet setup.

[yoshimitsuspeed]

This motor has a lot of extra stuff that should give it a good bit more capability than this dyno shows but it's still a good representative of that power range. The 16G should also be good for another 50 HP. Especially with his "Formula Atlantic" head and the cams you can see how much he could gain by a little higher redline. If he had kept going to 8500 he probably would have hit 350 without raising the boost. A little higher compression and some tuning should unleash a little more power as well. I assume he is on the 8.1:1 pistons. If so then you should be able to run a little more compression safely.

If you set your goals at 300 and went with a 14b or 2560R or something you could gain some low end spool without a whole lot of sacrifice on top.

[alltracfreak]

I would like to stay in the 9.2:1 to 9.5:1 range

[alltracfreak]

And being that the 20/40mm 4afe crank is cast should i use the ge crank?

[Evo_lucian]

93-97 4afe rods are 20/40mm

[yoshimitsuspeed]

I would like to stay in the 9.2:1 to 9.5:1 range

That's about what I was thinking too.

If the AFE crank is 40 then you will need the GE crank for the GE 42mm rods. Any way you cut it I would run the GE crank and rods if there was any difference between the two.

[alltracfreak]

Sorry meant to say 20/42mm fe crank. So even if they are i should run a ge crank?

[alltracfreak]

If all the mounting locations are the same then i might be better off looking around for a gze swap

[oldeskewltoy]

If all the mounting locations are the same then i might be better off looking around for a gze swap

could do worse... add a bit of machine work, a decent head, and 300hp is in the cards....

One note about the dyno yoshi printed out... the Web 101 cams are long duration... I'd recommend either Webs 294, or their 577 cams to go along with the boost... it'll keep overlap to a minimum

[yoshimitsuspeed]

I would not run Webs. I can get a couple choices that are a better bang for the buck.
That said the Web 101s are only rated at 250. A 264 would be no problem. If you look at what other turbo guys are doing, 3SGTE, 4G63 etc 264s are still considered a mild turbo cam.

I really want to see what a poncam does on a turbo build. I think it has a lot of potential.
http://matrixgarage.com/products/tomei- ... 64-81mm-ex

For just a little more you can get the kelford designed for boost. It has just a little more lift and 2 deg less on the intake and 2 deg more on the exhaust.
http://matrixgarage.com/products/kelfor ... agte-4agze

[alltracfreak]

Not a bad price for the poncams

[alltracfreak]

Ive heard good things about all the above mentioned cams

[yoshimitsuspeed]

Yeah, the poncam was designed for NA but it's specs are so close to the Kelford I think it would do alright. I think a little more lift might be good but for the price it would be hard to pass up.
My theory is that it may benefit more from an adjustable cam than say the Kelford because I suspect it probably has a little more overlap than the Kelford in stock timing. That said, overlap really isn't a problem on a turbo build unless your compressor side to pre turbine back pressure ratio get's too far out of hand.

[alltracfreak]

Ive seen people use 88 3sge cams on their 3sgte build and do real well.

[alltracfreak]

Regarding the axles for the gze transmission. Has anybody done business with the driveshaft shop with their custon axles? Couldn't i just do that?

[yoshimitsuspeed]

Ive seen people use 88 3sge cams on their 3sgte build and do real well.

I am running stock cams on my turbo 4A BT and it's amazing. Night and day difference in the top end over the old 16 valve. The bottom end and spool might have suffered microscopically but not enough I can be 100% sure. I would definitely consider stepping up to the poncams in this motor at some point.

[yoshimitsuspeed]

Regarding the axles for the gze transmission. Has anybody done business with the driveshaft shop with their custon axles? Couldn't i just do that?

I have been thinking about this a bit lately. It would be awesome to find a shop that could build sets for a reasonable price. I know some shops can rebuild damaged ones but I haven't heard of any getting them made from scratch. Seems like it shouldn't be too hard though. Most of the components are still available for other cars.

If it was my build I think I'd try the C series first and if I grenaded one too easily might look at other options like the E51.

[alltracfreak]

Theirs also a shop next to my friends shop and he says they can make me axles

[alltracfreak]

I just dont want to have to change my clutch after i get everything running