4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

canyon_carvers
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4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:53 pm

I'm re posting my build thread. I just in case it's gone since the last time the forum crashed.
I know a lot of you don't care for stories other then pictures and valuable info so I'll just get straight to the point. I will only elaborate on a section I feel it maybe important.
You can do this set up using the 4k dizzy but I'm going with a different route.
Webers fuel delivery: No more then 4 psi
Mikuni fuel deliver: no more then 3.5 psi
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Just showing you a SR5 harness with a Proactive 6 Ignition box & 4k Dizzy Startlet that had been modified w/4age dizzy to work with carb conversion but I dumped the dizzy & ignition box. I just needed the SR5 harness because I didn't want to chop up my GTS harness. You'll need a tach Adapter which is shown in this picture!
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40MM Mikuni Solex
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Kameari manifold
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small port studs and small port bolts for intake. I did 5 studs & 4 bolts.
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16mm freeze plugs to plug up your injector ports OR you can now buy injector port plugs from Technotoytunning for $25.00
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Holley FPR # 12-804
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Or you can go with a Malpassi FPR
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High pressure low volume carter fuel pump # GP4070 6psi AND you won't need no more then 4 to feed your carbs. and you can measure it through your FPR
If you are wondering, "why not I just use my stock fuel pump and have it regulate by a *return style* FPR (Aeromotive # 13301)" It should work right!? Heck no! It will spike SO bad your fuel gauge just get crazy! You'll just end up causing damage and giving you a inaccurate fuel reading.
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Aeromotive fuel gauge
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Innovation MTX-L #3844 (comes with harness kit, two face gauge (blake and white), bung (it's not shown in picture. I welded the bung to the test pipe) and gauge.
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these are wires coming off from the innovation gauge
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A vacuum reservoir I purchased from summitracing. You might noticed a change in your brake pedal.. Feels like a rock is behind the brake pedal and will not press all the way down because with the carbs it may not supply enough vacuum to the brake booster. With this, it will store and create more vacuum for you so you won't have to buy a $300 vacuum pump.
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just showing you how BIG the vacuum reservoir is
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MSD 6AL2 #6530
Dr. Orcca had posted a while back that you'll need the msd 6al and a msd timing ignition curve (#8981), those old part numbers are no good and had superseded to a new number. The timing ignition curve is not available anymore and is discontinued. Your best option is the 6AL2, a digital programmable! Hook it to your computer to map out your timing curve and set up your base map. There are lot of settings to this as I will get into more details about this.
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I didn't want to mount this in the engine bay (which a lot of people will do) so I mounted on the passenger floor side. Trying to keep it away from heat.
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Here is a wire diagram on how to wire up the MSD BOX and Tach Adapter. This isn't mine but from a member.
These are all the parts I needed to get the carb conversion set up going. You'll noticed after you had pulled out your GTS harness, you had also pulled out your wiper motor wires. I'll show you how to wire that up. Simply trace down the wiper plug & wires, you want to separate that out of your GTS harness. Using a pick, carefully removing the unwanted terminals and only keeping what you need on the wiper plug.
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this is what it should look like after you had removed the unwanted terminals & wires
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plug it back up to the junction block on the passenger side. Now your wipers work!


Now for the location of the fuel pump and plumbing.
You'll notice a lot of people will install the fuel pump up in the engine bay. NOT a good idea. You will only shorten the life of your fuel pump by doing that. A fuel pump is designed to PUSH fuel, not pulling fuel. Mount it near the fuel tank. If you can, mount it to where it is almost leveled with the tank.
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Here's where I mounted mine. The right rear quarter. I know, you're thinking if I get hit there, I'm F$%*!!! Well, I don't intend to get hit there... *crossing fingers*
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Here is a vague picture of fuel plumbing. Fuel will need to be in this order: tank>filter>fuel pump>filter>carbs

I'm running 268/268 crower cams w/adjustable cam gears.
My jettings are:
Pilot air-57..5
Air-180
Fuel-140
Accelerator pumps-40
Idle mixture screws.... I can't remember how much turns I did... sorry...
Here how it is
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=iTmnqIQ7AWI
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=G1eoFzWIz8c
Last edited by canyon_carvers on Sat Feb 22, 2014 5:30 pm, edited 4 times in total.

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canyon_carvers
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Tue Apr 16, 2013 10:59 pm

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for got to post picture of the project... it's a old picture of the car... I'll post up new one later..
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1st fuel line set up
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revised fuel line set up
Last edited by canyon_carvers on Sun Feb 23, 2014 9:03 am, edited 4 times in total.

yellowsnow4free
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby yellowsnow4free » Tue Apr 23, 2013 6:32 pm

I think I said this on the old forum, but great post; there's a lot of great info for carb enthusiasts on here :)

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Mr.Fujiwara
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby Mr.Fujiwara » Wed May 01, 2013 10:39 am

great detailed write up man!!
Old username: Charskiezz

20V BT: Traded For F20c Swap

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canyon_carvers
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Sat May 04, 2013 5:57 am

*VIDEOS* *VIDEOS*

Thanks guys! ^_^ and BIG thanks to Dr. Orcca who had been very helpful when I was doing the conversion. Here is a video a race event from last year. My friend driving his MK3 supra w/2JZGE, cat and mouse. The 1st run is me chasing him and then we switched over (in video at 46 seconds)... More videos later...
http://www.youtube.com/watch?v=RLi2Iq1-7mY
Then here I am slowly testing the Porterfield RS4 brake pads (getting used to the brake feel) and at the same time I was encountering some throttle linkage issue (You'll be able to tell how low my rev dropped and then I slowly worked it back up to the high rpm);however I continued to run the course when I should had stopped in pits. It was my first run of the day so as the hour went by, I got used to the RS4 and finally fixed my throttle linkage issue...
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=CKe3z-cqxtY
Last edited by canyon_carvers on Sun Feb 23, 2014 12:12 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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YOTAHOLIC808
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby YOTAHOLIC808 » Sun Jan 19, 2014 11:26 pm

Where are you getting your timing advance from??

6AL + 4AGE ECU??
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canyon_carvers
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Mon Jan 20, 2014 5:49 pm

MSD 6AL-2 programmable. You can map your timing curve however you like through your PC and the unique thing about it, is... You can have more then one setting so one base setting for daily driving and mulitiple ones for track days.

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby YOTAHOLIC808 » Mon Jan 20, 2014 6:22 pm

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So this is Basically all i need then? Im assuming the colors are different tho?...
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canyon_carvers
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Tue Jan 21, 2014 2:41 pm

You are correct! The colors are also correct. On the 6AL-2 Programmable, you'll end up with 2 or 3 harness coming off of the unit that you won't need unless otherwise (I never had to use it). I no longer run this set up anymore since I steered to a different engine build;however it was a superb setup and very easy to tune once you get to familiarize the carburetors & the MSD 6AL-2. I'm curious to know what kind of carburetors you're planning on using?

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby carbd7age » Wed Jan 22, 2014 7:50 am

Yes use that diagram for 4AC to carb'd 4AGE swap. It's easy as crap right there. Even the arch adapter part number is correct and active so your tach will still work.
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby kuroki86 » Mon Feb 03, 2014 7:58 pm

I have an extra 4ag lying around I was considering carb'ing. How much did the carb swap cost you total?

canyon_carvers
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Tue Feb 04, 2014 8:28 am

The carb conversion cost me about $1,500 (and that's with the carburetors). The Mikunis were used and I bought that for $500 w/intake so cost may vary depending on the carb you're going with (new,used, old school carbs or the latest and greatest technology carburetors)... Just keep in mind that used one will need some attention or a complete overhaul.

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby casket77 » Wed Feb 05, 2014 6:07 pm

Does the MSD seem pretty simple to tune on the laptop? btw nice project!

canyon_carvers
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Fri Feb 07, 2014 6:44 pm

It get simple once you familiarize yourself with the program. The nice thing about it, is you have the ability to map out your ignition curve however you like.
I no longer run this set up and had switched back to EFI ONLY because a super sweet BT 20v dropped into my lap and I couldn't refused (it was that good ^_^). I still love 4ages with a nice set of carbs though!!! Maybe when I can get a hand a 2nd 86, I'll do a carb set up on my second one... ^_^

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby __ke70__ » Sun Jun 29, 2014 8:37 pm

hey mate need help!

just done the same coversion but cant work out dizzy wires (red white blue) have red and white hooked up to msd but only doing 50% of the limited revs.

what have I done wrong?? haha

canyon_carvers
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Thu Jul 24, 2014 7:08 pm

I'm assuming you're running a MSD 6AL. The wires should be:
red-green
Red- violet (or purple)
just make sure the ignition box is dailed to the proper rev limit where you want it to be and the dailed to the correct engine cylinder.

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby bluey_AE86 » Fri Aug 29, 2014 10:59 pm

iv'e got a sprinter that came with a 4ac carbed and have now put a 16v 4age in and going weber carbs, it has never run the EFI so would i still have run all these parts?

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Wed Sep 03, 2014 5:53 pm

Yes, you would need these parts to run Weber's DCOE on the 4AGE 16v (this set up is a more simpler option; however there are other different set up besides this that will work). The 4AC was vacuum advance. Don't use the 4AC distrubitor on the 16v.

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby 808AE86inAZ » Wed Sep 03, 2014 9:31 pm

canyon_carvers wrote:Image

What wing is this ^^^ and where did u score it from?!
Step 1: Remove head from ass.

ay fu@k u ok, u don't kno me bra

http://www.eight08.net/features.html

canyon_carvers
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Thu Sep 04, 2014 5:44 pm

I purchased the rear spoiler from MODRIDE 7 years ago when the guy was still in business. There is a guy on Ebay that sell this very same style spoiler for the coupe. The seller goes by the user name "everspring_sports" and I believe he have only 5 left available.

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby saiGone » Wed Dec 17, 2014 10:51 pm

Whats up man?

I'm getting ready to do my carb set up.

Have:
16v hicomp
Webber 40 DCOE
TWM Manifold
Carter 4070 FP
Holley FPR # 12-804
3/8 braided feed line.
sr5 Bay harness

Need:
Plugs
MSD 6AL
msd timing ignition curve #8980 ( I found a used one available)
Tach Adapter 8920

My question is: where the tach adapter goes in that diagram? (diagram shoes 8980 which is timing computer)


Thanks
Club 4AG member since 05 (Formally SaigonsSon)

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YOTAHOLIC808
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby YOTAHOLIC808 » Fri Dec 19, 2014 7:45 am

Since you haven got your MSD yet. Just get the 6AL-2 Programable, then there is no need for a timing curve unit. Thats what I have, very simple install along with tach adapter. Cheers

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canyon_carvers
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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Tue Dec 30, 2014 4:06 pm

tach adapter is on diagram (8920)

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby Toy86 » Sat Feb 14, 2015 8:48 am

Canyon,

When you were running this set up, did you end up using the 4K dizzy from the starlet, or did you end up using the GTS? Also is there anyway to use the GTS dizzy with this set up? 4K dizzies are pretty hard to come by these days. Thanks man!

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Mon Mar 02, 2015 7:59 pm

I apologize for the late reply. I had the 4k dizzy but I never used it (already modified ready to work) so I sold it and I decided to use the GTS dizzy. The GTS dizzy will work with the proper set up. You could get MSD digital programmable or you could go old school and get a MSD timing ignition curve #8981, wich are discontinued and no longer available. The only way to aquire one is to buy it used.

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby Toy86 » Tue Mar 03, 2015 6:51 am

No worries, thanks for the infomation. Just to get a bit more calification, the MSD 6AL2 #6530 will allow you to run the GTS dizzy? By the way, i love you build and your 86, looks so clean!

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby canyon_carvers » Tue Mar 03, 2015 11:55 am

Thanks... and yes, the MSD 6AL-2 (6530) digital programmable will allow you to use the GT-S dizzy. You need to map out your timing cuve via laptop/computer. You don't need to get fancy about it, just set up a base map.

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Re: 4AGE 16V SIDEDRAFT CARB CONVERSION

Postby Toy86 » Wed Mar 04, 2015 1:24 am

Thanks man, you're da bomb!!!

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