OST-026: "My White Hatch"
Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
Very Nice Work!
- oldeskewltoy
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Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
casket77 wrote:Very Nice Work!
thank you.....
Some goodies arrived by UPS today.....
Not only are they well packaged in the shipment box... but the packaging for each cam is very... VERY nice...
and the 2 bump sticks - any guesses as to the grey line around #3 journals?
valve clearances and timing information....
More to come....
OST Cyl head porting, - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=300
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
- oldeskewltoy
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Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
from another forum wrote:That grey line looks a bit like an oil channel.
I thought so too... but when I ran my fingernail across it it was perfectly smooth. I'm not entirely sure... but I have a feeling that is a "control" for Toda to know if the cam was ever in an engine..... I have a feeling that once I install the cam and begin setting clearances, that line will go away.......
The head is currently @ Loynings getting surfaced, and getting a 3 angle along with a back cut.
The seat angles will be more akin to a race engine then a street engine.
Whats the difference??
Valve seat width..... valve contact point on seat
More to come......
OST Cyl head porting, - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=300
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
- oldeskewltoy
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Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
The head is back from Loynings...
They REALLY do a nice job...
That surface is good enough to read in its reflection... no guessing whose product that is...
so with the head back, I prepare to get chamber volumes....
I set up the burette...
grease (used as sealant) the valve seat... (notice that 30 degree back cut?)
take my first read.... and it moves.....
WHAT... it moves??
not really... what is moving is the fluid in the burette... even after closing the valve, fluid continues to weep out
the spicket is cracked... when you slip the valve into it, the crack (pointed out by the arrow) spreads and leaks......
I bought this nearly 5 years ago... paid about $120... I went back to the place I purchased it from... the spicket isn't available seperately not only that, but my local dealer no longer stocks it so its a week out
Sooooo, I go online... and viola... a new burette is on its way should be here by Tuesday... saved about $80 bucks too.
Equipment failure is annoying
more to come.....
They REALLY do a nice job...
That surface is good enough to read in its reflection... no guessing whose product that is...
so with the head back, I prepare to get chamber volumes....
I set up the burette...
grease (used as sealant) the valve seat... (notice that 30 degree back cut?)
take my first read.... and it moves.....
WHAT... it moves??
not really... what is moving is the fluid in the burette... even after closing the valve, fluid continues to weep out
the spicket is cracked... when you slip the valve into it, the crack (pointed out by the arrow) spreads and leaks......
I bought this nearly 5 years ago... paid about $120... I went back to the place I purchased it from... the spicket isn't available seperately not only that, but my local dealer no longer stocks it so its a week out
Sooooo, I go online... and viola... a new burette is on its way should be here by Tuesday... saved about $80 bucks too.
Equipment failure is annoying
more to come.....
OST Cyl head porting, - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=300
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
- oldeskewltoy
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Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
oldeskewltoy wrote:Equipment failure is annoying
lost a week...
but now that I have the new burettte, the chambers get measured...
35cc is the goal. the head was machined .016" (.4mm), and along with my chamber work...
2 chambers came in on target... 2 came in a touch small @ 34.7 cc. I did a little bit of additional work in the chamber walls between the valves on the small two and moved them up to 35cc as well.
With all the chambers @ their intended volume.... I begin re-assembly...
assembly of the head is finished.....
More to come.....
OST Cyl head porting, - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=300
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
- oldeskewltoy
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Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
oldeskewltoy wrote:assembly of the head is finished.....
More to come.....
note #1 on the exhaust cam and #2 on the intake cam (between cyl 2 and 3)... Since these are the same cam - both 272 ~ 9.0, the fact that they carry sequential numbers is a blessing for me... Why?? because it is now that I have to choose which cam goes where so that I can determine the final clearances....
and to determine the final buckets.... yep I said buckets.
My client is going the 1SZ one piece bucket route and it is up to me to determine the CORRECT bucket for each valve/lobe combination. The buckets above are the thinnest available - 5.12mm
First I check the clearances for the exhaust side...
I then swap the 8 sizing buckets and then I check the intake side....
I can be one of those crazy people who likes things as exact as I can make them.... sometimes, when you are checking valve clearances you sometimes wish you had the capability to measure down to .0005".
This is important when I'm purchasing 16 buckets and they are $12 each, I'd rather not get this wrong....
more to come.....
OST Cyl head porting, - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=300
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
- oldeskewltoy
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Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
oldeskewltoy wrote:
This is important when I'm purchasing 16 buckets and they are $12 each, I'd rather not get this wrong....
Ok.... since I don't want to get this wrong.......
how about a bit of a brain teaser...
the photo above is an intake cam lobe. Tell me what 1SZ bucket I'll need (10 digit part number, please)???
OST Cyl head porting, - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=300
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
- oldeskewltoy
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Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
from another forum wrote:my math says you need a 5.415mm thick bucket.
So the closest bucket is 13751-23180 @ 5.42mm thick
from another forum wrote:Still a bit sleepy but should be 5.42 which is 13751-23180
5.12+0.495 = 5.615 - 0.2 (for intake clearance) = 5.415 (all numbers in mm).
As the lifters are available in increments of 0.02 the 5.42 is the closest match.
Taken from the list here
from another forum wrote:13751-23280.
Edit.. nope that's less then .002" left.
13751-23180 (5.42)
that should leave about .0072"
Closest... yes.... but I wont be using that one, I'll be using 23170.
Here is why...
The cams call for an intake clearance of .2mm (.0078") If this head had either a plain lap-in, or a street 3 angle, I would say it was good enough.... BUT, remember this has a "race" 3 angle, the valve is cut 1 degree less then the seat. This means during break in the valve may move a tiny amount up on its seat. I asked a few machine shops who build race engines and .0005" should be accounted for....
So as much as I would really like to get the 23180, I purchased the 23170 instead.
**IF** I had my own equipment, I could disassemble that valve and clip the tip of the valve .0013" and be perfect with the 23180.
More to come....
OST Cyl head porting, - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=300
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
- oldeskewltoy
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Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
from another forum wrote:We change the seat width not angle the valve grind.
.040 wide for hi-po stuff and .060 wide for street.
A quick hand lap with ultra fine paste and the valves seal
Instantly. Recleaned before assemble of course.
I'm told this is a track engine, typically I use 040 for intake and 060 for exhaust on 4AGs...
from another forum wrote:How hard is it to grind the top of the valve? Measure the length of the valve before and after and use a grinding stone to cut it down?
Why do you run a 1 deg difference from the valve to the head? and what direction is "less"? Is the valve making contact with the head further inward or outward with the 1 deg difference? If it just seating pressure why not run a smaller seating surface?
Questions/suggestions are not a criticism I am asking because your work is beyond mine and the above is how I would do things
no criticism taken...
With the right equipment the valve is installed in a valve machine vice, and the machine will measure the tip, and then you set the grinder to take off the appropriate amount... very easy...
The contact point is further outward. As you break in the engine* the valve and seat pound together to form a nice tight seal. This pounding distorts the valve and seat slightly to provide an adequate seat and is why the valve may move up. The added degree on the valve allows for added filling on the initial opening and just before closing of the valve... think of it as an extra back cut
the exhaust valve ISN'T similarly cut, just the intake.
* another reason to break in an engine "hard"
OST Cyl head porting, - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=300
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
Amazing work! Can't wait to get this back!
'85 GT-S project since 2010
- oldeskewltoy
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Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
Wow...
its been 30 days... I TRIED to order the buckets through Toyota... they sold me the 8 sizing buckets... but alas they didn't "release" the 16 needed to set clearances (boooooo). Soooo... My client got them directly from Japan... and so we had a 30 day wait...
In the quote below.... see the cam lobe barely in frame on the right... that is #2 intake valve assembly...
..... and I should have had everyone check me on that one....
15 of 16 buckets are all well in tolerance... but #2 intake is too tight. It measures a tight .007" (.178mm), minimum is a tight .008" (.203mm), so I'm going to TRY (hope... prey... beg) that Toyota will release the one bucket I need....
here's hoping.... more to come......
its been 30 days... I TRIED to order the buckets through Toyota... they sold me the 8 sizing buckets... but alas they didn't "release" the 16 needed to set clearances (boooooo). Soooo... My client got them directly from Japan... and so we had a 30 day wait...
In the quote below.... see the cam lobe barely in frame on the right... that is #2 intake valve assembly...
ost wrote:oldeskewltoy wrote:
This is important when I'm purchasing 16 buckets and they are $12 each, I'd rather not get this wrong....
Ok.... since I don't want to get this wrong.......
how about a bit of a brain teaser...
the photo above is an intake cam lobe. Tell me what 1SZ bucket I'll need (10 digit part number, please)???
..... and I should have had everyone check me on that one....
15 of 16 buckets are all well in tolerance... but #2 intake is too tight. It measures a tight .007" (.178mm), minimum is a tight .008" (.203mm), so I'm going to TRY (hope... prey... beg) that Toyota will release the one bucket I need....
here's hoping.... more to come......
OST Cyl head porting, - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=300
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
- oldeskewltoy
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- Posts: 2180
- Joined: Wed Jan 09, 2013 4:44 pm
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Re: OST-026: "My White Hatch"
Toyota FAILED
.001" to be exact... thank you for the suggestion.
so I popped the valve out brought it over to "L" and asked them to tip it .001". 10 min later I got my valve back, installed it and we are good to go. The head is all boxed up and ready to ship...
from another forum wrote:Or remove the valve and have them take just a tad off the top of the stem if you didn't want to grind the bucket.
.001" to be exact... thank you for the suggestion.
so I popped the valve out brought it over to "L" and asked them to tip it .001". 10 min later I got my valve back, installed it and we are good to go. The head is all boxed up and ready to ship...
OST Cyl head porting, - viewtopic.php?f=22&t=300
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!
Building a great engine takes knowing the end... before you begin
Enjoy Life... its the only one you get!