Hi Everyone,
I have a 4age 20v ST swapped in a suzuki samurai.
i have the problem that when i put the ignition on, the check engine don't turn on,
then when i cranked it, it has a hard time to turn the engine on, and one second before its turns on the check engine light turns on.
if i ground TE1 the check engine don't blinked/flash, it only stay turn on.
when the engine is off, i DON't have check engine light so i also don't have diagnosis code either.
Batt, +B, B1, warning light wiring is all correct.... E01, E02, E1 are also correct.
ground betwen chassis, engine, body are all link up and woriking great.
The engine has a bad time idling but it is driveable, either way i think it is not a 100%
any thoughts?
my personal opinion is a bad Ecu.
Heres a linked so u can see it.
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=gWgnMY6rass
4age Silvertop 20v no diagnosis mode, erratic warning light
Re: 4age Silvertop 20v no diagnosis mode, erratic warning light
Here is the procedure for the 20V Blacktop, Silvertop will be the same...
1. If the Check Engine light does not come on immediately when you turn the ignition ON,
then you have a power supply issue. Check to see if you get 12V immediatly at the battery
connection to the ECU when you turn the key ON.
2. There are a list of conditions that apply when attempting to read codes. If some of these
conditions are not met, the ECU will not go into diagnostic mode.
3. You cannot ground T1 to the chassis. E1 in the check connector is not a chassis ground,
it is an ECU ground (same as used for 5V sensor grounds).
Cheers... jondee86
1. If the Check Engine light does not come on immediately when you turn the ignition ON,
then you have a power supply issue. Check to see if you get 12V immediatly at the battery
connection to the ECU when you turn the key ON.
2. There are a list of conditions that apply when attempting to read codes. If some of these
conditions are not met, the ECU will not go into diagnostic mode.
3. You cannot ground T1 to the chassis. E1 in the check connector is not a chassis ground,
it is an ECU ground (same as used for 5V sensor grounds).
Cheers... jondee86
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress
depends on the unreasonable man.
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress
depends on the unreasonable man.
Re: 4age Silvertop 20v no diagnosis mode, erratic warning light
E1 e01 e02 are chassis ground....E2 is a ECU ground.
Do you know the list of condition for not entering the diagnosis mode?
Do you know the list of condition for not entering the diagnosis mode?
Re: 4age Silvertop 20v no diagnosis mode, erratic warning light
You are correct... my bad 
List is at the top of the page shown above.
Cheers... jondee86
List is at the top of the page shown above.Cheers... jondee86
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress
depends on the unreasonable man.
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress
depends on the unreasonable man.
Re: 4age Silvertop 20v no diagnosis mode, erratic warning light
All the condition where checked..... any opinions?
Re: 4age Silvertop 20v no diagnosis mode, erratic warning light
STA wire connected ?
Many hard to solve problems are eventually traced to "leaking capacitors" inside
the ECU. Check to see if there are any signs of corrosion from electrolytes on the
printed circuit board.
Cheers... jondee86
Many hard to solve problems are eventually traced to "leaking capacitors" inside
the ECU. Check to see if there are any signs of corrosion from electrolytes on the
printed circuit board.
Cheers... jondee86
The reasonable man adapts himself to the world; the unreasonable one
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress
depends on the unreasonable man.
persists in trying to adapt the world to himself. Therefore, all progress
depends on the unreasonable man.
Re: 4age Silvertop 20v no diagnosis mode, erratic warning light
STA is wire in, i check it connected or not connected, (doesn't do any anormal thing), y checked de ecu capacitors and no sign of corriosion or burn out things in there.
Re: 4age Silvertop 20v no diagnosis mode, erratic warning light
If you open the ECU, look at the capacitors on the board.
Some of them leak the gel inside out onto the board, and this can also etch the traces as well causing opens and shorts.
Other capacitors can "bulge", either the top swelling up or the cylindrical sides swelling out.
All of the above are NOT good signs as far as anything goes.
Good news is that you can replace the capacitors (and also repair etched traces) and the ECU then will start performing as per spec again.
If you cannot find anyone else to do this repair of the ECU, I have done several for the Lotus Europa group on Yahoo successfully.
Hank Dozier
Some of them leak the gel inside out onto the board, and this can also etch the traces as well causing opens and shorts.
Other capacitors can "bulge", either the top swelling up or the cylindrical sides swelling out.
All of the above are NOT good signs as far as anything goes.
Good news is that you can replace the capacitors (and also repair etched traces) and the ECU then will start performing as per spec again.
If you cannot find anyone else to do this repair of the ECU, I have done several for the Lotus Europa group on Yahoo successfully.
Hank Dozier
"When the going gets, wierd, the Wierd turn Pro" -- Hunter S. Thompson
Re: 4age Silvertop 20v no diagnosis mode, erratic warning light
There aren't any leaking capacitors.... i will double checked and upload here some pics
more ideas?... i think i will replaced the ecu for another one... but don't want to spend 200 US and have the same problems.
more ideas?... i think i will replaced the ecu for another one... but don't want to spend 200 US and have the same problems.
Re: 4age Silvertop 20v no diagnosis mode, erratic warning light
The capacitors do not have to leak to become unstable. Check them for bulging on the sides and top.
That is a telltale the caps are failing and changing value.
Don't know where you got that $200 for fixing an ECU from, but my charge for the Lotus guys is $85.00 USF for the work using "gold standard" Panasonic Aluminum electrolytic capacitors. That plus shipping both ways, generally by FedEx or UPS which gives good service plus tracking and sufficient insurance.
I also add a heat sink to the VVT transistor as an extra precaution as they are prone to failure, especially on the Blacktop ECUs since they use a TO-126 Bipolar transistor rather than the TO-220 Hi-Wattage MOSFET used on the Silvertop ECUs.
If you take detailed pictures, make sure they are hi-rez closeups of the capacitors, especially of the base area and the tops.
You might have to place a link to a dropbox or storage site like Smugbug off of this forum as I think picture size is limited here.
If so, post the link and I will take a look.
Hank Dozier
That is a telltale the caps are failing and changing value.
Don't know where you got that $200 for fixing an ECU from, but my charge for the Lotus guys is $85.00 USF for the work using "gold standard" Panasonic Aluminum electrolytic capacitors. That plus shipping both ways, generally by FedEx or UPS which gives good service plus tracking and sufficient insurance.
I also add a heat sink to the VVT transistor as an extra precaution as they are prone to failure, especially on the Blacktop ECUs since they use a TO-126 Bipolar transistor rather than the TO-220 Hi-Wattage MOSFET used on the Silvertop ECUs.
If you take detailed pictures, make sure they are hi-rez closeups of the capacitors, especially of the base area and the tops.
You might have to place a link to a dropbox or storage site like Smugbug off of this forum as I think picture size is limited here.
If so, post the link and I will take a look.
Hank Dozier
"When the going gets, wierd, the Wierd turn Pro" -- Hunter S. Thompson
Re: 4age Silvertop 20v no diagnosis mode, erratic warning light
I know this is a month old, but let me add, replace your capacitors. I just went through the same thing. Last time I checked, my caps looked ok. I even conformal coated my board for some extra protection against elements. Then lent it out for someone to use and after it sat unused for a while. I finally got to swapping in 20v. It exhibited weird check ingine light behavior too. Coming on and staying on, not able to get diagnostic blink, running really bad with no power and rich. opened it up and lo and behold, all the caps had leaked. If its original, I would replace those caps even if they look ok. Its only a matter of time before they'll fail. The brand from that age is known to fail. And better to change them before the leak, cleaning up the board was probably the most PIA. Parts cost is ridiculously, cheap. The only reason the parts cost me just over $35 was because I paid for rush shipping, which was over $30 for the shipping. And I bought enough parts to do 3 sets just in case.
Youll pay for labor. Like I said, if you catch it before it leaks, then it should take an experienced electronics person less than 30 minutes to change the caps out. I'm sure less. But if they leak then you have to spend time cleaning the board and checking the traces haven't been damaged. I can do it myself, so it only cost me time. Its not incredibly hard to change, the ECU board is not very high density and not multilayered so working on it with soldering iron is not too bad. But if you have no experience with a soldering iron then it might not be so easy.
Youll pay for labor. Like I said, if you catch it before it leaks, then it should take an experienced electronics person less than 30 minutes to change the caps out. I'm sure less. But if they leak then you have to spend time cleaning the board and checking the traces haven't been damaged. I can do it myself, so it only cost me time. Its not incredibly hard to change, the ECU board is not very high density and not multilayered so working on it with soldering iron is not too bad. But if you have no experience with a soldering iron then it might not be so easy.